BTW, if Tim Alberta is to be believed, and I think he is, ("The Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory," HarperCollins, 2023), there is a new "lost cause" afoot, and it goes a long way towards explaining tfg's stranglehold on evangelicals.
Many of them are absolutely convinced that some combination of secularists, liberals, etc. don't merely want to avoid Christianity and keep our government separate from ALL religions, but are actively working to punish Christians and destroy everything that they hold dear. (Hence the concern about the so-called "war on Christmas).
I know, I know. I have never heard anyone except right-wing agitators mention any such thoughts, but apparently it's a deeply held theory and is why its adherents feel justified, even compelled, to "fight back by any means necessary," including using godless tools such as Donald J. Trump.
I am halfway through the audiobook of Tim Alberta’s “The Kingdom, The Power. & The Glory” it is a great book but hugely concerning to me that the Evangelicals have managed to grab so much power in all levels of our govt.
Those of us who still believe in separation of church & state have an awfully long, hard slog ahead to get them out
I don't so much want to get them out as to just have them proportionally represent their proportion of the population. I don't want them or anyone else dominating everyone just because they think they are right.
Those agitators are just pissed off that more people are choosing “none” when it comes to religion. They believe it’s a fight between abuse they shoved the marginalized people out the door and somebody calls it the perversion of the tenets of the faith they profess.
Trouble is they themselves set up these straw dolls to knock over. It's a near perfect example of cognitive dissonance, one that's almost impossible to get those afflicted by it to break away from.
There are so many great lines that stand out here, Reed, and I copied them all for they illuminate some exceptionally profound messages that everyone should hear. That entire "Lost Cause" moment of history has been forgotten by so many and/or handidly washed over by a large segment in that ever repainting of the truth.
I just happened to grow up at the heels of it, as my grandmother was from the Deep South, not the perfumed South, as she would say, and she would tell me about the Daughters of the Confederacy and all that States Rights narrative, of those White Abolisitinsts and all those chains of slavery they twisted into a retelling of heritage and Southern redemption, all sewn up like a Sunday dress and presented just as fashionably. It takes a lot of effort to turn such horrific pages of history into a seemingly cheerful portrait and reduce all those years of bondage to nothing more than a postcard of the past.
The fact that Haley had no problem ignorning it is indictive of that portrait that she and far too many not only cling to but refuse to release, determined to remain in that perfumed South of their own refashioning, where the sunlight shines through those old knarled trees instead of the shadows of the bodies that had hung from them. It's a sight they won't acknowledge and, like all the horrors of Trump, won't face. To do so they would have to admit they actually prefer the real portrait and, if given a chance, would happily return to it.
Thus the importance of what you wrote, because they now have that chance and knew it the moment Trump returned or even before with Jan 6. It's why they think of him as the savior, as the chosen one who can lead them back to that promised land of southern whiteness, where they can hang all their anger and racism back on the lines again, and can finally stop clinging to that watercolored version of them and their past. It's the old glory they want, the north vs the south, us vs them. It's in their bones. It's who they are. I know, because my grandmother told me all about it. She grew up with it. She lived it and she warned me that given the chance it would return. And now here we are. My grandmother is long gone, but her words have never left me and I hope everyone holds onto yours as well.
As you said, Lincoln understood this, and it's up to us now to try to end that struggle that he couldn't. We have less than 9 months, so keep writing, and thank you.
They never mention the reason the Confederacy fired on Fort Sumter was Maj. Anderson refused to surrender. The Confederacy had already seized basically every other fort, armory, navel yard, post office, you name it. Even several mints from which they stole the gold and currency. The Confederacy started with what must have been the greatest robbery of the United States.
My great grandfather was a member of the Grand Army of the Republic. Probably cost him his health like it did for so many that fought in the Civil War. Did Haley's comment make me angary? No. I am just astonished at her stupidly for such an answer. But of course, she is from South Carolina. She has probably heard the old southern version that the Civil War was about states' rights and ignored the end of the story that it was the right of the folks in the state to own slaves, etc. All I can say is, "Good grief! Haley! you had potential. Look what politics has done to you. I hope you soon find yourself. "
Reed the Podcast with Heather Cox Richardson was great. I learned and I was reminded of how things can combine for both good and bad. Thanks for all you do Reed. Take Care.
The thing I’ve learned about the “big lie” game is it doesn’t matter how big it is or how many times it’s proven false or how openly the disgusting bad faith actors are exposed. All that matters is that it’s in the same tribal emotional key of grievance, resentment, and victimhood.
Battle Cry of Freedom by James McPherson is probably the best all inclusive book on the build up to the civil war, the intricacies, and the end of with the beginning of reconstruction. It’s a large book but you won’t put it down. Also, The Republic of Suffering by Drew Faust. Though Battle Cry is by far the best.
As well as the Deep South but it will come to nothing as so many black Americans hold office in the south. Mayors, police chiefs etc...hold a lot of power in these state where they are a majority in some areas.
I’ve read countless books on our civil war and there was that one factor that encompasses every war we’ve been in save the Korean, WWI and WWII. The civil war was a rich man’s war and another, in this case, poor yeoman farmers fight. The wealthy plantation owners watched terrified while territories were becoming new free states and afraid the representatives from these states would eventually vote slavery out, starting with South Carolina these men of wealth just as today convinced the poor farmers that their lands would be taken from them, their women would be raped etc etc...and when Tecumseh Sherman came ripping through the south near the end this became a reality but by then most of the poor had thrown down their arms and went back home to their families.
There was years of build up to the civil war in the political arena. What went on in Washington affected what happened.
Let’s be clear there were still states as Maryland who were allowed to own slaves and the North was once slave owners.
A lot of the fighting force in the south were conscripted, forced away from their livelihoods and families depending on them.
Lincoln had his hoped for slavery to die out as it had in the north until
secession began.
Like all wars with a main cause there are countless variables that people can only know by reading extensively about it books by reputable authors. I’m guessing Haley hadn’t done this. It takes a special interest.
Quite right, Reed Galen.
BTW, if Tim Alberta is to be believed, and I think he is, ("The Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory," HarperCollins, 2023), there is a new "lost cause" afoot, and it goes a long way towards explaining tfg's stranglehold on evangelicals.
Many of them are absolutely convinced that some combination of secularists, liberals, etc. don't merely want to avoid Christianity and keep our government separate from ALL religions, but are actively working to punish Christians and destroy everything that they hold dear. (Hence the concern about the so-called "war on Christmas).
I know, I know. I have never heard anyone except right-wing agitators mention any such thoughts, but apparently it's a deeply held theory and is why its adherents feel justified, even compelled, to "fight back by any means necessary," including using godless tools such as Donald J. Trump.
I am halfway through the audiobook of Tim Alberta’s “The Kingdom, The Power. & The Glory” it is a great book but hugely concerning to me that the Evangelicals have managed to grab so much power in all levels of our govt.
Those of us who still believe in separation of church & state have an awfully long, hard slog ahead to get them out
I don't so much want to get them out as to just have them proportionally represent their proportion of the population. I don't want them or anyone else dominating everyone just because they think they are right.
They don’t all have to be gone but they currently have too much power.
Those agitators are just pissed off that more people are choosing “none” when it comes to religion. They believe it’s a fight between abuse they shoved the marginalized people out the door and somebody calls it the perversion of the tenets of the faith they profess.
What worries me is that they really believe that they themselves are victims (and therefore are justified in resorting to violence).
Absolutely
Trouble is they themselves set up these straw dolls to knock over. It's a near perfect example of cognitive dissonance, one that's almost impossible to get those afflicted by it to break away from.
There are so many great lines that stand out here, Reed, and I copied them all for they illuminate some exceptionally profound messages that everyone should hear. That entire "Lost Cause" moment of history has been forgotten by so many and/or handidly washed over by a large segment in that ever repainting of the truth.
I just happened to grow up at the heels of it, as my grandmother was from the Deep South, not the perfumed South, as she would say, and she would tell me about the Daughters of the Confederacy and all that States Rights narrative, of those White Abolisitinsts and all those chains of slavery they twisted into a retelling of heritage and Southern redemption, all sewn up like a Sunday dress and presented just as fashionably. It takes a lot of effort to turn such horrific pages of history into a seemingly cheerful portrait and reduce all those years of bondage to nothing more than a postcard of the past.
The fact that Haley had no problem ignorning it is indictive of that portrait that she and far too many not only cling to but refuse to release, determined to remain in that perfumed South of their own refashioning, where the sunlight shines through those old knarled trees instead of the shadows of the bodies that had hung from them. It's a sight they won't acknowledge and, like all the horrors of Trump, won't face. To do so they would have to admit they actually prefer the real portrait and, if given a chance, would happily return to it.
Thus the importance of what you wrote, because they now have that chance and knew it the moment Trump returned or even before with Jan 6. It's why they think of him as the savior, as the chosen one who can lead them back to that promised land of southern whiteness, where they can hang all their anger and racism back on the lines again, and can finally stop clinging to that watercolored version of them and their past. It's the old glory they want, the north vs the south, us vs them. It's in their bones. It's who they are. I know, because my grandmother told me all about it. She grew up with it. She lived it and she warned me that given the chance it would return. And now here we are. My grandmother is long gone, but her words have never left me and I hope everyone holds onto yours as well.
As you said, Lincoln understood this, and it's up to us now to try to end that struggle that he couldn't. We have less than 9 months, so keep writing, and thank you.
Well, said. Keep on telling the story.
Thanks so much, Maxine. It actually puts tears in my eyes just to think of it, but we all must keep telling it. Happy New Year and all the best ahead.
The Big Lie is this century’s Lost Cause. The parallels are remarkable.
They never mention the reason the Confederacy fired on Fort Sumter was Maj. Anderson refused to surrender. The Confederacy had already seized basically every other fort, armory, navel yard, post office, you name it. Even several mints from which they stole the gold and currency. The Confederacy started with what must have been the greatest robbery of the United States.
My great grandfather was a member of the Grand Army of the Republic. Probably cost him his health like it did for so many that fought in the Civil War. Did Haley's comment make me angary? No. I am just astonished at her stupidly for such an answer. But of course, she is from South Carolina. She has probably heard the old southern version that the Civil War was about states' rights and ignored the end of the story that it was the right of the folks in the state to own slaves, etc. All I can say is, "Good grief! Haley! you had potential. Look what politics has done to you. I hope you soon find yourself. "
Reed the Podcast with Heather Cox Richardson was great. I learned and I was reminded of how things can combine for both good and bad. Thanks for all you do Reed. Take Care.
Thanks, for at least referring to me as a "lady."
The thing I’ve learned about the “big lie” game is it doesn’t matter how big it is or how many times it’s proven false or how openly the disgusting bad faith actors are exposed. All that matters is that it’s in the same tribal emotional key of grievance, resentment, and victimhood.
Truly, Nikki is pathetic. She blew it big time when asked a legitimately simple question. i am so here for it!
Battle Cry of Freedom by James McPherson is probably the best all inclusive book on the build up to the civil war, the intricacies, and the end of with the beginning of reconstruction. It’s a large book but you won’t put it down. Also, The Republic of Suffering by Drew Faust. Though Battle Cry is by far the best.
As well as the Deep South but it will come to nothing as so many black Americans hold office in the south. Mayors, police chiefs etc...hold a lot of power in these state where they are a majority in some areas.
I’m seeing branches of the old Jim Crowe all over the US especially the Midwest and north west.
I’ve read countless books on our civil war and there was that one factor that encompasses every war we’ve been in save the Korean, WWI and WWII. The civil war was a rich man’s war and another, in this case, poor yeoman farmers fight. The wealthy plantation owners watched terrified while territories were becoming new free states and afraid the representatives from these states would eventually vote slavery out, starting with South Carolina these men of wealth just as today convinced the poor farmers that their lands would be taken from them, their women would be raped etc etc...and when Tecumseh Sherman came ripping through the south near the end this became a reality but by then most of the poor had thrown down their arms and went back home to their families.
There was years of build up to the civil war in the political arena. What went on in Washington affected what happened.
Let’s be clear there were still states as Maryland who were allowed to own slaves and the North was once slave owners.
A lot of the fighting force in the south were conscripted, forced away from their livelihoods and families depending on them.
Lincoln had his hoped for slavery to die out as it had in the north until
secession began.
Like all wars with a main cause there are countless variables that people can only know by reading extensively about it books by reputable authors. I’m guessing Haley hadn’t done this. It takes a special interest.
I wrote about Nikki too, in a round about way.
FYI: Thanks Reed. Been searching for your Heather Cox Richardson interview on Lincoln Project’s YouTube Channel but it’s not there. Cheers!
Look for this interview at Lincoln Project Podcast. Click on link for podcast---It was posted Dec. 26...
Eventually found it! Thanks!