Thanks for this Reed. 700 years ago Dante realized that words have tremendous power. He reserved the 8th Circle of Hell for Frauds who use their words to harm others for their own gain. Our time is not much different than Dante's Florence. He dealt with liars, thieves and frauds--and named names. Seven centuries later and human nature repeats on a much bigger scale.
On RFK, Jr and other noisy, irrelevant candidates: A vote for anyone other than Joe Biden is a vote for Trump. This must be broadcast far and wide. America cannot afford the distraction of idiots.
Now Donald is selling Bibles! One of history's greatest sinners grifting for money using the Word of God. The PTL Club is back! Jim Bakker went to prison for stealing from his followers. Who's next?
In pretty much all Western democracies, the majority of the electorate is politically unengaged. They either won't vote or will latch onto one thing ("Build the Wall!" or "Yes, We Can!") and then won't think much beyond that. But I've noticed a gentle drip, drip approach works with the unengaged. You need three talking points, say, health, education, and abortion (but it could be anything) where you know you can get your facts straight, and you simply mention one of those as an aside in a conversation. You don't get in a vituperative row, but the next time you meet them you say; "did you have time to think through what I mentioned before?". Never make it a central issue, never get strident, just express your concern and ask for their views. It seems to work. Preferably closer to the election than now.
Good article. I liked both quotes. A good quote can cover lots of sins. Let's not forget that Wisdom is ageless. Thanks, Reed, for sharing thoughts. Very helpful on how we might frame our own conversations with those of like mind as well as with those that are not quite on planet earth.
*****Not to say you should insult them, belittle them, or otherwise cause them to switch off. But it is important to give the undecided, the unaffiliated, the apathetic, a nudge in the right direction.*****
.
This is ENORMOUSLY important!
Persuasion is the key. Snark and belittlement clog the lock.
Also relevant to this post and our future is a David French column that the New York Times published the other day. Excerpt below the gift link.
An urgent task is to inspire people to pay attention and respond appropriately. The beating-people-over-the-head approach is unlikely to succeed.
*****[A]n online conversation isn’t the same thing as a national conversation.
I’m reminded of one of the most illuminating studies I’ve ever read. It came from the Hidden Tribes of America project, which was put together by a group called More in Common. It surveyed 8,000 Americans to try to explore their attitudes and conflicts beyond the red-blue divide, and one of its central conclusions is critical to understanding the modern moment: Only a minority of Americans are truly active in political debates, and they’re exhausting and alienating the rest of the country.
[...]
Together, [the] polarized wings are the most united, most tribal and least persuadable Americans. Or, as More in Common put it, members of the wings are “the most certain of their positions.” The rest of Americans — the other two-thirds — constitute an “exhausted majority.” They’re deeply discontented with American politics, and many are also largely disengaged.
[...]
This kind of exhaustion magnifies our political inertia. If the wings aren’t changing their minds and the majority is checked out, then stasis can set in. The engaged members of the wings are negatively polarized. There is no way they’re switching teams. The exhausted majority is discontent with the status quo, but it’s largely passive. It doesn’t exert nearly enough energy to repair our political culture, even though it wants change.
To better understand the dynamic, imagine our political controversies as a court case where the lawyers argue with each other but most of the jury doesn’t even arrive until the end of the case. Yes, they cast votes, but their decisions are rooted in their existing biases, not the evidence. The lawyers are livid at the absent jurors. The jurors are repulsed by the lawyers’ hostility, and nothing changes.
[...]
Experience teaches us that most disengaged Republicans would quite likely stay Republican even if they knew the truth about Trump. It’s also true, however, that absent new information, they have no good reason to change their votes. Yet when they disengage, they remove themselves from the information that could change their minds.
[...]
One friend told me, “I got sick of the constant rage.” So he deleted his social media accounts, turned his cable television from Fox News to ESPN and never looked back. “My blood pressure is down,” he said, “and I’m a better husband and father.” Good for him, I thought, but bad for us. Another decent man has disengaged. Another member of the jury has left the courtroom.*****
The baby and bathwater example is hard to reconcile. Denial is very powerful until you are faced with change that you did not ask for. The abdication of the masses is unfortunate but the idea that there is some equivalent level of bludgeoning going on is perception painted by the media and not a real thing. I see the seething on the right and the horror on the left, which is not the same thing at all. The last decade Dems would say "when they go low we go high" in an attempt to inspire and elevate, but somehow resulted in more people not turning out to vote because they weren't inspired enough, and I don't think that is about the candidates or choices, I think it's the narratives that are put forth by the media and a thwarted idea of what is realistically possible. Seedlings of discontent with who they are and misleading speculation about what they are going to do. People said things like, I voted for Bush because I'd rather have a beer with him as he made fun of intellectuals despite being an elite ivy trust fund baby who really lives in maine. Honestly? People in NYC didn't vote for trump because they knew he was a fraud, but he sold the rest of the country on his fake accumen as a businessman. His money comes from family and selling his name onto buildings he doesn't actually own, he's a long con who sold out the Italian mob for the Russian mob and people think their 401 balances are going to go up or tax bills down with him in office, and that's the story the media focuses on and the real choice the electorate makes. The dereliction of civic responsibility (I was raised im the 70s so this concept is alien to many) will haunt them later when someone carts away their neighbors or family or they have to make truly soul-compromising choices to preserve their 'lifestyle'. Ignoring the flame doesn't mean it won't burn you, but that's a personal choice. Glad your friend can rationalize tuning out instead of finding a way to engage constructively. This isn't really that hard a choice if you care about the consequences, and I know lots of people who engage just enough to have a clue without it sending them to the ER. The fatigue is real, but so is the responsibility of having the freedom to choose who governs - for the common good or the elite few.
Thanks for this Reed. I listened to your podcast with Danny. I know he has to hold the academic line and talk about the scholarly disagreements about fascism. I’m glad that you get talking about the political or pragmatic situation in which we find ourselves.
The only way, at this point, to start to diminish the power of MAGA is to defeat not just Trump, but MAGA GOP up and down the ballot. Thank you for this essay and a great podcast episode.
"Not as bad as Trump" is the lowest possible bar for anyone to slither over. Almost any one of us, including Unca Joe, looks like a saint next to Agent Orange.
That doesn't mean Joe's a good option, even if he's the best one. He opposed school busing, defamed Anita Hill and gave us Clarence Thomas, voted to invade Iraq, and has a very peculiar idea for how to handle classified documents.
On top of that, he's 81 and while he's pretty fit, it's a mistake not to follow that with "for a man his age." We're being asked to bet on an 86-yr old man as our President. While Trump, of all people, has asked us to check if we're better off than 4-yrs ago, we should also be looking 4 years ahead. We can all cite a number of octogenarians who are pretty sharp, but it's invariably anecdotal. Not many of us make it that far and those who do are overwhelmingly likely to have major health issues. An acquaintance just checked his wife into dementia facility and they are @ 80. That's a helluva bet we're being asked to take with absolutely no assurance "it'll all work out."
Genocide is not a political problem. It is a moral one. We cannot, no matter what the cost, support those who commit or are accomplices to genocide. Genocide is the crime of all crimes. It is the purest expression of evil. We must stand unequivocally with Palestinians and the jurists from South Africa. We must demand justice. We must hold Biden accountable for the genocide in Gaza.
The hottest places in hell are reserved for those, in times of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.” - Dante Alighieri
The great moral crisis that you would have us ignore is the GENOCIDE of the Palestinian people by the Biden administration. Normalizing genocide in the most powerful nuclear capable country in the world puts the whole world at risk and when the republicans eventually take over again the next genocide will be even worse.
liar...Biden has never taken part in genocide...neither have the Israelis. Genocide is the planned destruction of a people by others.. Genocide happened to the Israelis on October 7th, by the Palestinians. Hamas is made up by Palestinians people. The people of that area of Gaza, etc. have had billions of dollars of aid for years given to them by other countries, including the USA. The land is fertile and their crops are often exported...Why is this not said? Because of ANTIsemitism...
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
Israel met all five of these conditions to be guilty of the crime of genocide well before the Hamas attack on October 7th.
Israel does NOT KILL MEMBERS of a Group...It protects itself from terrorism. Do you think that the Palestinians/Hamas are just loving on Israel? Wake up. The Palestinians want to kill every Israeli...THAT IS Genocide. Israel wants to live in peace. The country of Israel, established in 1948; has been violently attacked and the people of Israel have been murdered by the Arab nations; including the Palestinians. So wake up and stop being a bigot against Israel.
1- provided all the munitions for the genocide. The WaPo reported over 100 arms transfers just under the limit that would require notification and approval from Congress. U.S. law prohibits transfers of arms to countries where they would reasonably be expected to be used against civilian populations.
2- positioned troops in Jordan and Syria to discourage any other country from intervening to stop the massacre.
3- provided US troops for aerial reconnaissance and targeting over Gaza.
4- attacked Yemen for trying to stop ships headed for Israel.
5- using their UN veto power to protect Israel from any UN repercussions.
6- worst of all took money away from the UN organization that is trying to stop Palestinians from starving to death. The United States is actually helping to starve civilians based on unsubstantiated claims by Israel that 15 of 30,000 UNWRA employees may have been involved with Hamas information that now appears likely that Israel obtained by torturing Palestinian prisoners.
Criticising Israel is not antisemitic. Antisemitism is a real problem and is horrible but using it to excuse GENOCIDE by Israel dishonors the real victims of antisemitism and false claims of antisemitism are disgusting.
The USA, under Biden, has NOT Taken money away from the Palestinians. The organization from the UN that no longer is supported by decent countries took part in the slaughter and torture of the innocent Israeli civilians! It has been proven; even if you choose to believe the lies of Hamas. Criticizing Israel protecting themselves from murdering, rapists, and despicable people who want all of Israel destroyed is ANTIsemitism. Targeting over GAZA: GOOD! HAMAS needs to be targets. Are you pro-murderers ??? The massacre was FROM THE Palestinians towards the Israeli people...Are you not able to read? What happened on Oct.7th?? Was that ok with you? Racist actions to the Jewish and non Jewish people of Israel that were slaughtered, raped, and mutilated and kidnapped. All WAR uses arms that might harm civilians. Israel has been attacked and terrorized by the Palestinians, and other Arab people since the people of Israeli have lived on the land for thousands of years. Does Israel have the right to protect themselves? Or should Israel be swept away "to the sea?" This is what is taught and preached by the Islamic governments every single day. The land where the Palestinians live have plenty of crops and water. It is all dishonest propaganda. The numbers of "dead" are not even truly known. Except we do KNOW how many Israeli innocents were killed and tortured and kidnapped.
As if the democratic party platform offers anything close or resembling to the “ideals it is America“ intended by the framers? You’re fucking Trippin. Aside from a few basic human rights, there is no statistically significant difference whatsoever. If you’re playing argument boils down to that, we’ve lost a long time ago. The only way to change this choice of fascism versus despotic totalitarianism is to stop the blind, ignorant tribal allegiance, and remove all barriers for Vallet access to other parties. There is one other way, but there’s not a snowballs chance in hell it will happen. #MassCivilDisobedience and performance of duty by the citizens.
Do you even know what your #Duty is?
Per the Declaration
“But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”
Thanks for this Reed. 700 years ago Dante realized that words have tremendous power. He reserved the 8th Circle of Hell for Frauds who use their words to harm others for their own gain. Our time is not much different than Dante's Florence. He dealt with liars, thieves and frauds--and named names. Seven centuries later and human nature repeats on a much bigger scale.
On RFK, Jr and other noisy, irrelevant candidates: A vote for anyone other than Joe Biden is a vote for Trump. This must be broadcast far and wide. America cannot afford the distraction of idiots.
Now Donald is selling Bibles! One of history's greatest sinners grifting for money using the Word of God. The PTL Club is back! Jim Bakker went to prison for stealing from his followers. Who's next?
https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-utter-ridiculousness-of-trump-bibles
In pretty much all Western democracies, the majority of the electorate is politically unengaged. They either won't vote or will latch onto one thing ("Build the Wall!" or "Yes, We Can!") and then won't think much beyond that. But I've noticed a gentle drip, drip approach works with the unengaged. You need three talking points, say, health, education, and abortion (but it could be anything) where you know you can get your facts straight, and you simply mention one of those as an aside in a conversation. You don't get in a vituperative row, but the next time you meet them you say; "did you have time to think through what I mentioned before?". Never make it a central issue, never get strident, just express your concern and ask for their views. It seems to work. Preferably closer to the election than now.
Good article. I liked both quotes. A good quote can cover lots of sins. Let's not forget that Wisdom is ageless. Thanks, Reed, for sharing thoughts. Very helpful on how we might frame our own conversations with those of like mind as well as with those that are not quite on planet earth.
Reed wrote:
*****Not to say you should insult them, belittle them, or otherwise cause them to switch off. But it is important to give the undecided, the unaffiliated, the apathetic, a nudge in the right direction.*****
.
This is ENORMOUSLY important!
Persuasion is the key. Snark and belittlement clog the lock.
Also relevant to this post and our future is a David French column that the New York Times published the other day. Excerpt below the gift link.
An urgent task is to inspire people to pay attention and respond appropriately. The beating-people-over-the-head approach is unlikely to succeed.
.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/22/opinion/christian-nationalists-polling-divide.html?ugrp=c&unlocked_article_code=1.fU0.yu2w.jrcgkpgvsr7n&smid=url-share
*****[A]n online conversation isn’t the same thing as a national conversation.
I’m reminded of one of the most illuminating studies I’ve ever read. It came from the Hidden Tribes of America project, which was put together by a group called More in Common. It surveyed 8,000 Americans to try to explore their attitudes and conflicts beyond the red-blue divide, and one of its central conclusions is critical to understanding the modern moment: Only a minority of Americans are truly active in political debates, and they’re exhausting and alienating the rest of the country.
[...]
Together, [the] polarized wings are the most united, most tribal and least persuadable Americans. Or, as More in Common put it, members of the wings are “the most certain of their positions.” The rest of Americans — the other two-thirds — constitute an “exhausted majority.” They’re deeply discontented with American politics, and many are also largely disengaged.
[...]
This kind of exhaustion magnifies our political inertia. If the wings aren’t changing their minds and the majority is checked out, then stasis can set in. The engaged members of the wings are negatively polarized. There is no way they’re switching teams. The exhausted majority is discontent with the status quo, but it’s largely passive. It doesn’t exert nearly enough energy to repair our political culture, even though it wants change.
To better understand the dynamic, imagine our political controversies as a court case where the lawyers argue with each other but most of the jury doesn’t even arrive until the end of the case. Yes, they cast votes, but their decisions are rooted in their existing biases, not the evidence. The lawyers are livid at the absent jurors. The jurors are repulsed by the lawyers’ hostility, and nothing changes.
[...]
Experience teaches us that most disengaged Republicans would quite likely stay Republican even if they knew the truth about Trump. It’s also true, however, that absent new information, they have no good reason to change their votes. Yet when they disengage, they remove themselves from the information that could change their minds.
[...]
One friend told me, “I got sick of the constant rage.” So he deleted his social media accounts, turned his cable television from Fox News to ESPN and never looked back. “My blood pressure is down,” he said, “and I’m a better husband and father.” Good for him, I thought, but bad for us. Another decent man has disengaged. Another member of the jury has left the courtroom.*****
The baby and bathwater example is hard to reconcile. Denial is very powerful until you are faced with change that you did not ask for. The abdication of the masses is unfortunate but the idea that there is some equivalent level of bludgeoning going on is perception painted by the media and not a real thing. I see the seething on the right and the horror on the left, which is not the same thing at all. The last decade Dems would say "when they go low we go high" in an attempt to inspire and elevate, but somehow resulted in more people not turning out to vote because they weren't inspired enough, and I don't think that is about the candidates or choices, I think it's the narratives that are put forth by the media and a thwarted idea of what is realistically possible. Seedlings of discontent with who they are and misleading speculation about what they are going to do. People said things like, I voted for Bush because I'd rather have a beer with him as he made fun of intellectuals despite being an elite ivy trust fund baby who really lives in maine. Honestly? People in NYC didn't vote for trump because they knew he was a fraud, but he sold the rest of the country on his fake accumen as a businessman. His money comes from family and selling his name onto buildings he doesn't actually own, he's a long con who sold out the Italian mob for the Russian mob and people think their 401 balances are going to go up or tax bills down with him in office, and that's the story the media focuses on and the real choice the electorate makes. The dereliction of civic responsibility (I was raised im the 70s so this concept is alien to many) will haunt them later when someone carts away their neighbors or family or they have to make truly soul-compromising choices to preserve their 'lifestyle'. Ignoring the flame doesn't mean it won't burn you, but that's a personal choice. Glad your friend can rationalize tuning out instead of finding a way to engage constructively. This isn't really that hard a choice if you care about the consequences, and I know lots of people who engage just enough to have a clue without it sending them to the ER. The fatigue is real, but so is the responsibility of having the freedom to choose who governs - for the common good or the elite few.
Thanks for this Reed. I listened to your podcast with Danny. I know he has to hold the academic line and talk about the scholarly disagreements about fascism. I’m glad that you get talking about the political or pragmatic situation in which we find ourselves.
The only way, at this point, to start to diminish the power of MAGA is to defeat not just Trump, but MAGA GOP up and down the ballot. Thank you for this essay and a great podcast episode.
"Not as bad as Trump" is the lowest possible bar for anyone to slither over. Almost any one of us, including Unca Joe, looks like a saint next to Agent Orange.
That doesn't mean Joe's a good option, even if he's the best one. He opposed school busing, defamed Anita Hill and gave us Clarence Thomas, voted to invade Iraq, and has a very peculiar idea for how to handle classified documents.
On top of that, he's 81 and while he's pretty fit, it's a mistake not to follow that with "for a man his age." We're being asked to bet on an 86-yr old man as our President. While Trump, of all people, has asked us to check if we're better off than 4-yrs ago, we should also be looking 4 years ahead. We can all cite a number of octogenarians who are pretty sharp, but it's invariably anecdotal. Not many of us make it that far and those who do are overwhelmingly likely to have major health issues. An acquaintance just checked his wife into dementia facility and they are @ 80. That's a helluva bet we're being asked to take with absolutely no assurance "it'll all work out."
Genocide is not a political problem. It is a moral one. We cannot, no matter what the cost, support those who commit or are accomplices to genocide. Genocide is the crime of all crimes. It is the purest expression of evil. We must stand unequivocally with Palestinians and the jurists from South Africa. We must demand justice. We must hold Biden accountable for the genocide in Gaza.
Chris Hedges
Ridiculously un self aware Reed Gallen.
The hottest places in hell are reserved for those, in times of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality.” - Dante Alighieri
The great moral crisis that you would have us ignore is the GENOCIDE of the Palestinian people by the Biden administration. Normalizing genocide in the most powerful nuclear capable country in the world puts the whole world at risk and when the republicans eventually take over again the next genocide will be even worse.
liar...Biden has never taken part in genocide...neither have the Israelis. Genocide is the planned destruction of a people by others.. Genocide happened to the Israelis on October 7th, by the Palestinians. Hamas is made up by Palestinians people. The people of that area of Gaza, etc. have had billions of dollars of aid for years given to them by other countries, including the USA. The land is fertile and their crops are often exported...Why is this not said? Because of ANTIsemitism...
The UN defines genocide as:
Article II
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
Israel met all five of these conditions to be guilty of the crime of genocide well before the Hamas attack on October 7th.
Israel does NOT KILL MEMBERS of a Group...It protects itself from terrorism. Do you think that the Palestinians/Hamas are just loving on Israel? Wake up. The Palestinians want to kill every Israeli...THAT IS Genocide. Israel wants to live in peace. The country of Israel, established in 1948; has been violently attacked and the people of Israel have been murdered by the Arab nations; including the Palestinians. So wake up and stop being a bigot against Israel.
The Biden administration has:
1- provided all the munitions for the genocide. The WaPo reported over 100 arms transfers just under the limit that would require notification and approval from Congress. U.S. law prohibits transfers of arms to countries where they would reasonably be expected to be used against civilian populations.
2- positioned troops in Jordan and Syria to discourage any other country from intervening to stop the massacre.
3- provided US troops for aerial reconnaissance and targeting over Gaza.
4- attacked Yemen for trying to stop ships headed for Israel.
5- using their UN veto power to protect Israel from any UN repercussions.
6- worst of all took money away from the UN organization that is trying to stop Palestinians from starving to death. The United States is actually helping to starve civilians based on unsubstantiated claims by Israel that 15 of 30,000 UNWRA employees may have been involved with Hamas information that now appears likely that Israel obtained by torturing Palestinian prisoners.
Criticising Israel is not antisemitic. Antisemitism is a real problem and is horrible but using it to excuse GENOCIDE by Israel dishonors the real victims of antisemitism and false claims of antisemitism are disgusting.
The USA, under Biden, has NOT Taken money away from the Palestinians. The organization from the UN that no longer is supported by decent countries took part in the slaughter and torture of the innocent Israeli civilians! It has been proven; even if you choose to believe the lies of Hamas. Criticizing Israel protecting themselves from murdering, rapists, and despicable people who want all of Israel destroyed is ANTIsemitism. Targeting over GAZA: GOOD! HAMAS needs to be targets. Are you pro-murderers ??? The massacre was FROM THE Palestinians towards the Israeli people...Are you not able to read? What happened on Oct.7th?? Was that ok with you? Racist actions to the Jewish and non Jewish people of Israel that were slaughtered, raped, and mutilated and kidnapped. All WAR uses arms that might harm civilians. Israel has been attacked and terrorized by the Palestinians, and other Arab people since the people of Israeli have lived on the land for thousands of years. Does Israel have the right to protect themselves? Or should Israel be swept away "to the sea?" This is what is taught and preached by the Islamic governments every single day. The land where the Palestinians live have plenty of crops and water. It is all dishonest propaganda. The numbers of "dead" are not even truly known. Except we do KNOW how many Israeli innocents were killed and tortured and kidnapped.
Brilliant and true
As if the democratic party platform offers anything close or resembling to the “ideals it is America“ intended by the framers? You’re fucking Trippin. Aside from a few basic human rights, there is no statistically significant difference whatsoever. If you’re playing argument boils down to that, we’ve lost a long time ago. The only way to change this choice of fascism versus despotic totalitarianism is to stop the blind, ignorant tribal allegiance, and remove all barriers for Vallet access to other parties. There is one other way, but there’s not a snowballs chance in hell it will happen. #MassCivilDisobedience and performance of duty by the citizens.
Do you even know what your #Duty is?
Per the Declaration
“But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”
Simply put, you have no standing, Sir
Great quote.